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Documents needed for a indo french marriage in India

 
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mocholoco
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 7:00 am    Post subject: Documents needed for a indo french marriage in India Reply with quote

Hey friends,

So finally after staying in France with my girl and meeting her sweet family, I am pretty sure that she's the girl I'd like to spend all my life with. She is moving to Mumbai in Jan on an E visa to work here.

We plan to get married in Mumbai under the Special Marriage Act 1954. IN order to register under this act, we neeed some documents which are as follows :

A proof of address, visa copy, passport copies and A CERTIFICATE FROM THE FRECNH CONSULATE STATING THAT MY FIANCEE S SINGLE. My fiancee tried to find out info on this certificate and she says its kinda complicated as they need alot of documents which also includes my Birth certificate issued in not less that 3 months, celibacy certifcate and police clearance in India.

I was born in Bahrain and we moved to India in 1991, so getting a BC is next to impossible. What is a celibacy certificate? how can that be obtained in India.

Please shed some light all you "been there, Done that" guys Smile

Thanks
Murtaza
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Bliss
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 11:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello,

First for you to obtain a birth certificate,
you can simply get an affidavit from a lwayer who is been recognized and approved by the french consulate(verify with the nearby french emabassy)and get it also translated in french by the same lawyer, as it may be required any time during the process.

Secondly, for your fiancé she needs to go to her town hall/Marie and get a document stating that she is single, which is a normal step to get before married.She has to meet the people responsible with the wedding paper works at the Marie.
She needs to take the family booklet of her parents for verification, if asked by the people.

Good Luck for you and your Fiancé.

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Bliss
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Sourav
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 12:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For her celibacy certificate, what Bliss has told will do. She can get a paper from her town hall (won't be tough) which then can be attested by the french consulates of Mumbai.

Marriage under special marriage act of India shouldn't be tough, but they may play dirty as it happened during our time. The special marriage act of India is a bit tricky and is primarily meant for Indians of different religions marrying each other, or for an Indian marrying a person of Indian origin living in a foreign country.

I had a heated argument with our judge who told he can't marry us telling me to show him where it is written in the special marriage act that this is applicable to an Indian marrying a foreigner. I had to counter him asking to show me where it is written that an Indian can't marry a foreigner. Later I even had to launch complain against him to the Deputy commissioner.

Hope things will be smoother in your case. Once you submit your papers in marriage court, they will keep the information hanging in their notice board, after which you guys can tie your knot.

*******************

To register your marriage in the french embassy you will have to get everything attested by the home ministry (as it was during our time, and unless it has changed by now) office. Again, not tough but people may play dirty. What I have seen that in general neither the French authority, nor the Indian authority wants their people to marry a foreigner, and hence cause problem.

In the home ministry office, again we had to pass through the stage of "threatening to complain to the higher authority". In the French consulate, they might do the same. Our marriage officer of the french embassy who was to register our marriage was trying to convince my wife telling her different stories on how Indians marry their citizen only to dump them after getting the French nationality.

So these are the things you might be aware of.

All the best.
Cheers.
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mocholoco
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 1:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Saurav,

So, does it mean that my birth certificate or the affidivit is not one of the prerequisites for my fiancee to obtain a Celibacy certificate in her Town Hall .

Do you think she can obtain one purely on the basis of her proof of French citizenship and her parents Book of Marriage / Marriage Certificate ???
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Sourav
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 1:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Your birth certificate shouldn't be a prereq. for your partner to get a celibacy certificate. Why it should be, logically? These are the examples of people playing dirty again. But if you have to:

For your birth certificate, we don't have the concept of birth certificate issued less than 3 months ago, unlike France. You can get your birth certificate photocopied and attested by the home ministry, which will be less than 3 months old.

Celibacy certificate could be a simple affidavit by an advocate. How else can you prove it? Again, a home ministry authentication might be needed.

For police clearance, this can again be an affidavit issued by the local police station. If these are three papers they are asking, get them, and then get all of these three attested by the home ministry. That should be fine.

Once done, all these papers might need to get translated and attested by a certified french translator. Check with the Alliance francaise to get one, or ask the french consulate to give you a list of translators whom they recognize.
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mocholoco
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 1:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Exactly !! There is no logic behind a 3 month old original birth certificate....I did figure out there is something fishy regarding this information...How can a original be reproduced with already one orignial...I think a original is only possible if the previous one is misplaced or lost? Does that make sense ? Smile
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Sourav
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 1:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually in France they don't issue a birth certificate as in India. They write your name in small booklet called "livre de famille" (of your parents) on your birth. They have a service where you go and ask each time you need a birth certificate, and they give you an attestation sort of thing, which acts as a birth certificate and remain valid for three months.

So, they tend to apply the same theory everywhere. Given that in India we are issued a birth certificate on our birth, we can't reproduce this whenever we want. So, we need a photocopy here, attested by the home ministry.
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mocholoco
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 1:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

True ! In my case, I will have to go to the Ministry of Health in Bahrain as I was born there.
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Universal
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 4:50 pm    Post subject: Re: Documents needed for a indo french marriage in India Reply with quote

murtazabaker wrote:
Hey friends,

So finally after staying in France with my girl and meeting her sweet family, I am pretty sure that she's the girl I'd like to spend all my life with. She is moving to Mumbai in Jan on an E visa to work here.

We plan to get married in Mumbai under the Special Marriage Act 1954. IN order to register under this act, we neeed some documents which are as follows :

A proof of address, visa copy, passport copies and A CERTIFICATE FROM THE FRECNH CONSULATE STATING THAT MY FIANCEE S SINGLE. My fiancee tried to find out info on this certificate and she says its kinda complicated as they need alot of documents which also includes my Birth certificate issued in not less that 3 months, celibacy certifcate and police clearance in India.

I was born in Bahrain and we moved to India in 1991, so getting a BC is next to impossible. What is a celibacy certificate? how can that be obtained in India.

Please shed some light all you "been there, Done that" guys Smile

Thanks
Murtaza



At the very outset a Very Happy Diwali to all of you.

So often there are questions related to mixed marriages and the difficulty faced to find the documents asked for by the foreign authorities.

For the convenience of Murtaza and others in similar situations I am going to explain certain things in detail.

Regarding the mixed marriages and the requirements of documents....this is common for we Indians to get confused with all the papers the French or any other western authorities ask in order to issue the Certificate of Marriage or the Marriage Permission " Capacite de Mariage".

For your marriage to be accepted by the Embassy or Consulate , first you have to get this permission or certificate.

One can get married the way one feels and wishes, but then for the marriage to be accepted officially by the country concerned you have to go by the laws they have set up.

In order to get the marriage valid for the foreign authorities, you have to submit the documents they ask for , first they need to check, verify, take interviews, and then they issue the permission for marriage. Then your marriage has to be registered and the certificates have to be attested by both the Ministeries in India , that is Home and Foreign.

Usualy it seems difficult but then there are logics to it and one can manage to get the documents asked for.

They know that it is difficult for many Indians but it is possible to get such documents and so they ask for them.

For example at some Embassies and Consulates they also ask for your parents marriage certificates.

For most of us it sounds too much and near to impossible if the parents were married 50 / 60 years back, and we have never been so particular about getting such certificates, specially till 15/ 20 years back we in India never thought much about all this...like getting Birth Certificates or Marriage Certificates.

One needs to understand that it is important and justified why they ask for such documents, like birth certificates, bachelorship certificates, proof of address, etc.

Why they ask for Parents marriage certificates,I will give one example why this is also important.
There have been cases in France where it turned out that the 2 persons intending to get married were in fact brothers and sisters, and as it is termed in France , "Mariage Blanc". (The woman in France was a a french citizen of some other origin and she was trying to get her own brother into France).

So to make sure that what you state about yourself is all correct and that the marriage is a genuine one and not for any other reasons.

The logic why they ask for "Birth Certificate" which is not older than 3 months is that in France... Birth, Death, Marriage,Divorce is registered at the Marie and they have all the records and as Sourav has mentioned it is all written in the "Livre du Famille. They call it "Etat Civil" where they have all the records of a person's status and any change in status.

So a French does not have to go many places to get all the documents. Everything is very systematic and all the records are there and computerised and it's in the Mairie which issues.

For us it's difficult we have to get each of the documents from different places and if you are not having any of those, you may get the Affidavits from Indian civil courts and get them attested by the ministeries in India.

Recently I have read in the newspapers that in India too it's going to be made compulsory to get the marriages and divorces , registered, no matter which religion you belong and how you get married.

Till now we have Municipal Corporations where only Birth and Death registerations are done, and that too is not always done by so many. But since several years it has become almost impossible to get admission in schools and to get passpoprts if you do not have a bith certificate. ( Those born after 1990 have to produce original birth Certifcates, to apply for the passport.)

So it's a very good step and soon in India too we are going to have the similar system and all the records will be stored at the same place and documents will be easily available if and when required for any purpose.

Now in your case Murtaza, you were born in Bahrain in 1991.

You must be having your Indian Passport ...

What document ( as evidence to your date of Birth ) was submitted for your Indian passport ?

As per the laws "It is mandatory to submit Birth Certificate in cases of those who are born on or after 26.01.1989."

What was the certificate or document submitted for your passport to justify your date of birth ?

If it was some paper issued by the hospital in Bahrain, where you were born that too is important as you might need it very often specially for your future in France that is if you intend to go and live in France in future.

I also suggest Murtaza if you could read the topic "" Mixed marriages, between an Indian and a French ( May 19th),"" where Sourav, others and me have written a lot on this topic.

If there is anything you do not understand and if you need anymore informations do not hesitate to ask.

Wish you good luck .

Razi ( in India )
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mocholoco
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 5:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, I do have a indian passport. I have received a Original Birht Certificate issued in 1991, that is, when me and my family left Bahrain and came to India for good. Since then we havent gone back. So, yes I submittted a photocopy of my birth certificate and got my passport whch mentions my country of birth as Bahrain. Smile
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RR
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 09, 2010 4:27 am    Post subject: Help-docs required for an Indian marrying a French in France Reply with quote

I have written a similar query to Swati as she went through a similar situation but all you guys here seem very knowledgeable about this topic so please do help me out with the below queries.

Dear All,

I have registered here to clarify my doubts about the 3 main documents that I need to submit. i will also explain my case so its easier for you to help me out in getting clarity.

I am an Indian and I met my fiance in Bombay. He is French and we want to get married asap in Montpellier. Now let me tell you what I have.

1. Birth Certificate - I was born in Kanpur in UP and coz we never really needed a birth certificate, dont think we got one until 2006 when my mum went back to UP and got my BC. Now I have one issued in that year. I found an agency in Bombay called Excellent Apostille Services, an authority that does attestation for education and non-educational purposes by the Ministry of External Affairs.

Questions:
A. I would guess that if they do the apostille and stamp it on the day they finish the authorization, should it not be valid to show that its less 3 months old??? Or do i have to go back to UP where no one lives currently and get another one?? It might take time but maybe possible to get one.

B. Will this apostille thing by the agency, their website is: www.apostille.hbcompany.in be enough to and accepted by the City Hall??

C. Will I have to go the Indian Embassy for anything again?


2. Certificate of Coutume -

A. I am Indian living in India (at present in the US visiting family but leaving in 10 days) so can I still go to Paris to the Indian Embassy there and they will issue it for me for 24 euros?? I will be travelling to Paris in Jan and then to Montpellier to submit the documents at the City Hall.


3. Certificate of Celibacy - This has been giving me the most problem.

A. I read in your post where you talked about 'Affidavit of Honor' to be done by your parents in front of the notary. I dont have a dad, lost him when I was very young so in my case it will be my mother who lives in Andhra Pradesh. She said she can get it done. Now the question:

A. What was the exact copy going in the Affidavit of Honor? I am clueless and you have done this so need some help.

B. Did you get this Affidavit apostilled? and from where?

C. What does it this certificate actually mean? Meaning of celibacy can be interpreted in many ways but I dont know what we are declaring by saying 'I am celibate'. Is what you actually used., that you are celibate?

D. Lastly did it the Affidavit of Honor work out for you at the City Hall?

Before I end, another important question, did you go to the Indian Embassy in France for anything before submitting the docs at Montpellier. Please do remember I reside in India and will be travelling on schengen visa to Paris to do all this work. I know you were on a student visa so just thought Ill point it out.

Thank you so much for your help Swati. Really counting on you to help me understand these documents. Its stressing me out.
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tani
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2011 11:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello everyone, I hope to get a direction from this forum, its basically my last resort. so guys please help me with information. Im from kolkata, (f). Me and my french fiancé was all set to tie the knot on 17th february, 2012, till we got the blow at the last moment. We started with the marriage process from june 2011, doing the papers to get the 'no-permission letter' from the french embassy. It was a terrible and time consuming process, but we got it done. We thought that was only the hard part. But now we are stuck with a new problem. We approached 2 marriage registrars before, and they denied saying marriage between an indian and a foreigner is not possible. Finally we appointed another marriage registrar, who finally took our case. We filled the forms,submitted the necessary documents along with it, but today, the marriage registrar returned back all the documents telling that, the marriage registration office or wherever it is supposed to be filed for the notice of 30 days, denied our papers, cz none of the partner has stayed in each other's country for 3 months. I am doubtful about the knowledge of government employees of India even the marriage registration officials , who definitely deals with marriages, but dont know much about the different types of cases and situations in Indian- foreigner marriages. I am searching desperately for a good, knowledgeable lawyer or a marriage registrar, credible enough, who can tell us the exact solution to our situation/ problem, or if at all any hindrance can come in the marriage procedures for reason that none of us have stayed in each other's countries for more than 30 days. 1) Do you guys know if this last mentioned point at all necessary?
2) Please let me know of any lawyer or marriage registrar who is well aversed with marriage laws between an indian and a foreigner.
Its a real emergency, cz we need to file the case before 16th january,to have a notice period from 16 jan to 16 feb. I have always known that in a franco- indo wedding, the french part was tougher, the indian laws werent obstructing, except for the 1 month marriage notice period: but here I am stuck with the registration process of the indian law.
3) Are the marriage laws in different states of india, different? cz if its so, we will try to get it done from any other state, incase if its allowed.

An early solution will be really helpful.
Thanks in advance.
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